Lithium batterys explained(ish)

[jonuk76]

Thanks for that I don't think I'll try them on the charger I have. If in doubt, don't do it seems to be a pretty good plan as far as lithium batteries go    A suitable charger from DX is pretty cheap anyway.

BTW, I believe Lithium Iron Phosphate and Lithium Polymer are different types. Lithium Polymers (LiPo) do explode as can be seen here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3o_2mwRPdw

[magestorm]

Yes, current setups do not allow for one to get regular batteries and pop them in.  They are meant to be about the size of a ciggy.  Now, is it POSSIBLE?  Yes, it is.  The attys should be able to accept 4.5v from 3 AAA batteries.  You might need to drop in a resister to drop the voltage down to 4V.  Or, getting NiMH AAA, at 1.25v, should bring it to the low end of where it needs to be. 

Look in the mods area, and you'll find several mods.  Personally, I'd love to see one made from a recycled iPod, with one of THOSE batteries wired up and ready to serve.  You think you get long battery life listening to music, just wait till you try the new iVape 

But, if you know how to do some basic electronics, it's not hard to build the guts of a mod. 

[moog]

I thought this is an interesting link for why e-cig batteries don't last very long......click

[trog100]

Try a Janty stick (it takes cheap 10440 batteries) and combine it with a 5 pack of 801 atomisers from TW. 801 atts are pretty reliable, and 5 ought to last a loooong time

we have a sweet little cigarette sized manual  switch device that takes a cheap 10440 battery... way better than any janty stick... he he

sadly they are not ready for market yet.. they will be tho.. we just need to get them made.. we have the working prototypes..

basically they are about as near cigarette sized as possible whilst still taking a replaceable lithium cell.. they should have the same run time as the JS.. but be based around a more sensible size atomizer..

trog

[trog100]

I thought this is an interesting link for why e-cig batteries don't last very long......click

now you know why i got banned from the place moog... he he

trog

[Crossbow]

Try a Janty stick (it takes cheap 10440 batteries) and combine it with a 5 pack of 801 atomisers from TW. 801 atts are pretty reliable, and 5 ought to last a loooong time

we have a sweet little cigarette sized manual  switch device that takes a cheap 10440 battery... way better than any janty stick... he he

Funnily enough, my 3rd stick has keeled over, and my main vape is a Garry Dibley 10440 torch mod

[Larry]

Funnily enough, my 3rd stick has keeled over, and my main vape is a Garry Dibley 10440 torch mod

What's happening to your sticks anyway?  I've had a few problems with mine too but I keep fixing them.  Flooding the circuitry has been the main problem but the button got screwed up on one of them and I figured out how to fix it(which is quite easy) but the button problem is inexcusable and just poor design and/or poor assembly.  At work the other day the vapor on my afternoon stick tapered off then just stopped working completely.  It's a good thing I had my morning stick in the box so I finished the day off with that.  Got home and took apart my stick and squirted it down with alcohol, let it dry off and now it's working fine again.  The leaking problem wouldn't happen if Janty took the small effort to design the 801 atomizer properly.  A vent hole on the side of the atomizer(just like the 901 atomizer) and plug the three holes at the bottom would prevent any juice from leaking into the circuitry no matter how flooded the atomizer gets.  Mostly stupid stuff is causing the problems with the Janty stick and it's ashamed.

[Crossbow]

The first one suffered total switch failure (it fell off)
The second suffered some kind of electrical fault (the magic smoke escaped)
The third has basically drowned. It was pretty clear it wasn't going to last long once juice started leaking out of the switch and usb port everytime I put a fresh cart in. It still kinda works - but not well enough to be more than annoying

[Larry]

It's rediculous that those things are happening with the janty stick when most problems could be avoided if they put a tube about half the length of the atomizer and sealed it at the bottom near the connector.  Then, no matter how much the atomizer leaked, it wouldn't get into the rest of the stick.  Cheap!  I'm sure we're not the only ones having these problems but I guess Janty thinks it's cheaper to replace defective sticks than to spend an extra dollar or two to fix the problem.

[moog]

I did hear a distant rumour that there might be a V3......

[Larry]

They have a few things in the works right now but I haven't heard anything about the stick yet.  Just a small sealed fitting on the end of the atomizer would solve the leaking problem.  No need for another version unless they want to make it into a flash drive or mp3 player.  Right now they have the Cameo, Baby J, Ego, twin box and Telsa filter and all are just prototypes right now.

[moog]

I think the Cameo is on the back burner......the other prototypes just don't appeal...The JS was something that was really quite popular and to make it more sturdy and leak proof would be a winner.....

[Larry]

I'd like it leak proof as well but that's a design flaw they should have addressed in the beginning. 

[Crossbow]

The only good news is that they can be picked up much cheaper now, but even so, at a stick every 2 months, I don't think I'll bother

[Larry]

If you're handy you could always rip out the electronics and turn your stick into a no frills box mod.  That's what I plan on doing if mine ever dies.

[exogenesis]

Not sure how I missed this thread the first time round Crossbow,
but this is certainly a great help in understanding Li batteries.

Helps a lot , thanks

[Syanidi]

great information.

Thanks,

[TheNige]

Great information indeed....but a bit lost on me. 

Perhaps some kind soul could briefly explain the do's and don'ts of unprotected batteries is simple terms for us simple people.
Lets say I had 2x UltraFire (yikes!) TR15270  600mAh 3.0v batteries to charge a 6v device....(lets call it a copper.)

How long are they safe in the charger?
"The atomiser will die off way before the batteries reach a dangerous state of low charge"...but if these batteries were then removed,set aside and forgotten about,would they evenually lose charge to the point of becomeing unstable?

Yeah....Do's and dont's...
What should I do?....and what shouldn't I do?
I can't see them being exceptionaly dangerous or they wouldn't be on the market.Would they?

Cheers
Nige.

[Phil A.]

IIRC, the main thing about unprotected batteries is don't charge them in a charger that's got no "intelligence" in it to prevent overcharging as there's a risk of them blowing up if you overcharge. Also, if you short-circuit one without short circuit protection, it can catch fire or explode. Unprotected batteries are designed to be used in a device that has protection in it (which is why there's none in the battery)
There's actually a picture on this forum somewhere of someone's Janty Stick which did get very badly damaged (to the point of being unrecognisable) so whilst unprotected batteries aren't super dangerous, you do need to be aware that bad things can (and occasionally do!) happen with lithium ion batteries...

[TheNige]

Thanks Phil....That helps a bit.Dont over charge and dont short-circuit.
I'll need to check out if my supplied charger is "intelligent" but even so I can keep a check on that.

What about completly draining them?Anyone?

[exogenesis]

Isn't that what crossbow meant about 'protected' batteries being all about,
i.e. they cut out below 3.x volts, stopping them draining completely & irreversibly chemically changing.

[Crossbow]

Having 'discharged' batteries lying around for long periods of time (multiple weeks) could be an issue, potentially, although the self discharge rate is pretty low. They shouldn't become unstable - more likely just unusable.

As for leaving them in the charger - in theory, as long as either the charger or battery is protected against overcharging, it shouldn't be a problem, but it's certainly good practise to remove them after they are charged. It's not worth worrying about too much though - I tend to charge batteries over night, and so far have had no failures of any sort.

[TheNige]

Thats cool....Thanks Crossbow......Maybe I'll get some sleep tonight. 

[AlanShaw]

Hi all, do the 280 ma batteries that are on the TW site at £12.99 produce more vapour as well as lasting longer??

[Crossbow]

The larger capacity means they will be ever so slightly better, but the main thing is just that they will last longer

[smurf]

Hi all,

This discussion is very interesting. My question is this: Do the lithium batteries have memory? What I have heard is some rechargeables have memory and that if you say for instance, have all you ecig batts dead, can you do like a half hour charge just to get your vape fix? Will this be a problem? 

[NandyDC]

Somewhere I had read that there is no memory problem with the lithium...

[capt12b]

I agree with nandy, if they had a memory the pcc would not be good for the batts at all  

[smurf]

Thanks guy's. That has been constantly on my mind since I got my first starter kit. I was afraid that if I kept taking them out of the charger as soon as the light went green they might end up with a shorter usage time between charges. The manual says charge for eight hours the first time. Then it says the batt is ready when the light goes green. Sometimes my batts only charge for an hour at the most, then the light is green. I just want to get the most usage as possible from the batt. But don't we all? 

[Chaotic]

Great thread everyone, lots of good information, keep it flowin.